I just beat Shiela, and...

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Edmond Dantes
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I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Edmond Dantes » Mon Jul 21, 2014 09:57 pm

... did Caleb just rip out that webbed-up dude's heart and eat it?

Can someone transcribe what Caleb says during this scene? I heard him say "sorry, old friend" and then quote something about needing to eat blood and flesh to have life, and I'm not sure I get it. After all, he didn't eat Ophelia...

(Also, compared to that big gargoyle in Episode 1, Shiela was kind of easy. I just kept pounding her with napalm)
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Tchernobog » Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:36 pm

Okay, a few things. First off, it is Shial, not Shiela or Sheila. Sheila was a cow we once owned.

Secondly, the line Caleb says is actually taken from the Bible, specifically John 6:53: "For truly, I say unto you, unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you."

As to why he does what he does, well, it is presumably to gain the strength he needs to defeat Tchernobog. The reason he did not do the same thing with Ophelia's corpse was probably because he loved her too much and felt it would be disrespectful.

Gabriel, on the other, is evidently fair game for Caleb. Lucky him.
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by dosgamer000 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:42 pm

In addition to Tchernobog's comments about Caleb's affection for Ophelia, perhaps he also felt burning her was better off than leaving her on the slab or giving her a burial site. The Cabal is known for creating patchwork zombies from corpses and bodies so it would be foolish to give her such a vulnerable grave. You cannot piece together ashes, however.

Regarding Gabriel, for the longest time I assumed him to be dead. The reasoning I've conjured for the still-beating heart is a connection to Tchernobog or "chosen energy." Not the same type of thing that kept Caleb from decomposing but just the fact that he was one of Tchernobog's elite kept his heart, his Life Essence, from dying. Other than that, the body itself was probably dead from suffocation.

Shial is extremely easy and literally has no attack other than to keep spawning red and green spiders to do the fighting for her. The "challenge" is perhaps the idea of you fighting a giant spider queen in an underground lair full of webs. I'd hate to imagine what an arachnophobe would do during that fight.
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Edmond Dantes
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Edmond Dantes » Tue Jul 22, 2014 08:29 am

I was half-asleep and starving when I posted, so yeah... that's why I didn't remember her name.

... anyone else notice that Caleb has a lot in common with Chakan: The Forever Man? That might make an excellent concept for a team-up (assuming, of course, Caleb himself isn't one of the supernatural evils that Chakan is forced to hunt down and slay... and assuming Caleb could stomach having any kind of partner for very long).
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by dosgamer000 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:32 am

Edmond Dantes wrote:I was half-asleep and starving when I posted, so yeah... that's why I didn't remember her name.

... anyone else notice that Caleb has a lot in common with Chakan: The Forever Man? That might make an excellent concept for a team-up (assuming, of course, Caleb himself isn't one of the supernatural evils that Chakan is forced to hunt down and slay... and assuming Caleb could stomach having any kind of partner for very long).
At the very least, he does bare a resemblance to Caleb. The cowboy himself was apart of a 4-man group while in the Cabal so he can tolerate a partner, that we know. Or else they would've already been dead before the game even began!
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Edmond Dantes » Wed Jul 23, 2014 04:20 pm

I'm guessing anyone who died and returned to life will look kinda dark, really.

There's one big difference between them tho... Chakan is a genuinely good guy. Caleb steps on people to get to secret areas ;)
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Tchernobog » Wed Jul 23, 2014 05:03 pm

Edmond Dantes wrote:There's one big difference between them tho... Chakan is a genuinely good guy. Caleb steps on people to get to secret areas ;)
Well, to paraphrase RWS: "He's only as violent as you are!"

:P
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by dosgamer000 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:09 pm

Tchernobog wrote:
Edmond Dantes wrote:There's one big difference between them tho... Chakan is a genuinely good guy. Caleb steps on people to get to secret areas ;)
Well, to paraphrase RWS: "He's only as violent as you are!"

:P
I'm really glad Monolith designed Caleb's character the way he is. He's not a full-blown, save-the-world hero nor is he a diabolical nemesis who just wants to end the world (well, there was that bit about letting it burn in Blood 2 but you get my point.) He is a man who has goals and will reach said goals in any way he sees fit and preferably in a method that's fun. Caleb's idea of fun is bloodshed and killing anyone for kicks by chance, an immoral trait, but he does have nobility in him. He is sickened with Tchernobog casting him down and wants revenge for his allies. He feels the Cabal is corrupt and has wronged him severely; for such crimes they must pay with their very lives. You can only expect so much from a character born and raised in the violent universe of Blood after all. There are so many shades to his character and ways one can interpret his personality, which is possibly one of the reasons he's so well remembered among the old FPS heroes of BUILD. Story wasn't that big a deal back then and Blood's isn't breaking ground but it does provide a character and lore that is possibly the most taken care of by it's developer. It's not a throwaway plot, IMO. A true morally ambiguous character, like Kain from the Legacy of Kain series.
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by BEAST » Tue Sep 02, 2014 03:41 am

dosgamer000 wrote: You can only expect so much from a character born and raised in the violent universe of Blood after all. There are so many shades to his character and ways one can interpret his personality, which is possibly one of the reasons he's so well remembered among the old FPS heroes of BUILD. Story wasn't that big a deal back then and Blood's isn't breaking ground but it does provide a character and lore that is possibly the most taken care of by it's developer. It's not a throwaway plot, IMO. A true morally ambiguous character, like Kain from the Legacy of Kain series.
When my friends introduced me to the Legacy of Kain series, I totally saw parallels between Caleb and Kain, as well as with Raziel. I had thought that perhaps that the Blood series could borrow elements of storytelling and narrative from the Blood Omen and Soul Reaver games. Soul Reaver 1's bossfights in particular, because they have that indescribable monstrosity aspect which is perfect for a Blood boss. If they can't be incorporated into official games of the franchise, then at least mods for B1 or 2.

Even though Caleb's a very sick, sadistic bastard, he is loyal to his friends. When he drank Gabriel's heart, he showed some respect when he said "Forgive me, old friend." I was surprised to hear him say that when I first saw the cutscene.
Tchernobog wrote:Okay, a few things. First off, it is Shial, not Shiela or Sheila. Sheila was a cow we once owned.

Secondly, the line Caleb says is actually taken from the Bible, specifically John 6:53: "For truly, I say unto you, unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you."

As to why he does what he does, well, it is presumably to gain the strength he needs to defeat Tchernobog. The reason he did not do the same thing with Ophelia's corpse was probably because he loved her too much and felt it would be disrespectful.

Gabriel, on the other, is evidently fair game for Caleb. Lucky him.
He probably was mixing Shial with Shelob from The Lord of the Rings. Personally, I would like to see an update of Shial which makes her as big as Shelob. Maybe Sheila could be used as the name for a descendant of Shial's for a future game.
Edmond Dantes wrote:I was half-asleep and starving when I posted, so yeah... that's why I didn't remember her name.

... anyone else notice that Caleb has a lot in common with Chakan: The Forever Man? That might make an excellent concept for a team-up (assuming, of course, Caleb himself isn't one of the supernatural evils that Chakan is forced to hunt down and slay... and assuming Caleb could stomach having any kind of partner for very long).
I find that Caleb has similarities with The Crow, Spawn, Kain, and Raziel. He's the darker half of a crazy Clint Eastwood role and Marshal James Anderson. I've never read Chakan, but it does remind me of a Korean-based comic book which was admitted by the writer to be inspired by Blood's story. It was once mentioned on the Wiki article of Blood, but I can't find it anywhere.
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Tchernobog » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:28 am

BEAST wrote:He probably was mixing Shial with Shelob from The Lord of the Rings. Personally, I would like to see an update of Shial which makes her as big as Shelob. Maybe Sheila could be used as the name for a descendant of Shial's for a future game.
I'm sorry, but I still insist that this is only true Sheila:
Image
BEAST wrote:I I've never read Chakan, but it does remind me of a Korean-based comic book which was admitted by the writer to be inspired by Blood's story. It was once mentioned on the Wiki article of Blood, but I can't find it anywhere.
You are thinking of Priest by Min-Woo Hyung:
http://www.blood-wiki.org/index.php/Priest
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Edmond Dantes » Sat Jan 24, 2015 06:54 pm

Another character who (superficially) reminds me of Caleb is Robert E. Howard's Solomon Kane. The two are polar-opposites--Solomon Kane is insane and thinks he's on a quest from God to eliminate evil, so he's genuinely a nice guy until you do something villainous (usually rape or murder), then he'll kill your ass. One of the short stories has him trapping a horde of demons in a house then setting the house on fire.

Fun fact--Robert E. Howard's characters (which include Conan the Barbarian) canonically take place in the same universe as H.P. Lovecraft's Cthulhu Mythos. Which I honestly think Blood could stand to be a part of (there's already a Miskatonic University so its got its fingers in it).

... Has anyone ever attempted a novelization of the Blood games? If not, I might try my hand at it.
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by N0t_mINe » Sat Jan 24, 2015 09:48 pm

Edmond Dantes wrote:Has anyone ever attempted a novelization of the Blood games? If not, I might try my hand at it.
Not specifically the actual games, but Tchernobog recently treated the community to an epic fanfic, Scroll. It's been stickied here in tfn's Blood forum.
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Re: I just beat Shiela, and...

Post by Tchernobog » Sun Jan 25, 2015 10:32 pm

Edmond Dantes wrote:... Has anyone ever attempted a novelization of the Blood games? If not, I might try my hand at it.
I would be very interested in seeing this. :)
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