This I Ask You, Fellow Bloodites

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Shagg E
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This I Ask You, Fellow Bloodites

Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 04:30 am

I've been trying to avoid any mention of this, since it has been attempted before by many, and has always ended up as vaporware, so this will probably be met with a great deal of skepticism.

I'm talking, of course, about a full-blown fan-sequel to Blood. Or in this case... "Blood 3: Amputation", on the Source engine. It's called Amputation because we want to amputate Blood 2 from the timeline, and branch off from Blood 1 in a completely new direction, while retaining the atmosphere and overall feel of the original.

It's one hell of a task, but this project *will* be finished. I know, I know... but seriously, we refuse to give up on it. In fact, we think we may have already accomplished something no fan-sequel attempt has before, which will come as a very pleasant surprise to you all once we have it confirmed.

Anyway, the point of all this is, we want something of this scope to be as good as possible.

So, I ask: What do you want or absolutely do NOT want to see in this game?
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Post by Gila » Sun Sep 09, 2007 05:43 am

blood 2 is a good game (though rushed really and full of bugs) so why would anyone cut it off... i personally don't like fan sequels or fan fiction (i frigging loathe these AMVs too, what a stupid thing is that).

oh and here comes cheapalert with darkplaces engine...
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 05:55 am

Fair enough. But I think Blood 2's storyline was ass, so I'd rather not incorporate it into 3.

And what do you mean "here comes cheapalert with darkplaces engine."?
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Post by ghoste-not logged » Sun Sep 09, 2007 05:35 pm

I'd rather make Source port (transform existing levels and art into new format) instead of building up a fan-made sequel with new storyline. I believe fans cannot make any competitive sequel. It always lower grade when compared with originals. However there can be exceptions.
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 07:13 pm

That was actually the original idea, but we stopped when we found out about Transfusion. So now it's a sequel. I can't guarantee it being in the same caliber as the official games, of course, but it'll be free at least. :D

And who knows, it just might turn out to be decent.

So yeah, rephrasing time: Assuming people liked fan-sequels, ( :P ), what would their ideal Blood 3 contain?
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Post by kurt » Sun Sep 09, 2007 08:18 pm

Shagg E, I can understand your desire to "amputate" Blood 2 from the timeline, because I've always felt the same way. But I came to realize that rather then erasing it from existance, it needed to be carefully repaired and redone instead.

Even after all this time, Blood 2 still has a great deal of potential, and "a full-blown fan-sequel" is already being worked on.

To get an idea of the direction for this project, a short video was created to demonstrate the possibilities and potential of this redone sequel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLgA4Oa1mx8


I normally don't care for any fan-made projects either, but I am hoping that my exhaustive efforts might eventually prove to be an exception with most people.

You are right though that "a full-blown fan-sequel" is "one hell of a task".

Follow your dreams, and the best of luck in all of your endeavours.
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 08:57 pm

I definitely can't wait to play your revision of Blood 2, it looks to be what it should have been all along. :D

The reason I want to "amputate" Blood 2 is due to it causing massive restrictions to the storyline. (which will become clear when it's finished)

By the by, I'm not treading on your project by announcing mine in the same place, am I? I hadn't realized that you are also aiming for a similar goal.
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Post by ghoste-not logged » Sun Sep 09, 2007 09:01 pm

what would their ideal Blood 3 contain?
There was many similar threads before, the question is to worn out to be popular. All information you need is here on forums.
That was actually the original idea, but we stopped when we found out about Transfusion.
why not work on that. TF being developed very long time (perhaps longer than Blood itself) with no sufficient (IMO) progress made. The thing I really hate about Transfusion is thats most models are rough-edged after recalling smooth sprites from Blood. Source offers more abilities for developers with newer generation effects. Two parallel projects will rise the quality of each other.
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Post by I Live...AGAIN » Sun Sep 09, 2007 09:44 pm

I dont think it's that bad of an idea at all...

But rather than "remove" Blood 2 from the time line, why not just ignore B2's story? What I mean is... there is plenty of time between the story from B1 and B2 and what took place.

If you have some nice innovations planned, and the game will play on xp with a nice port, it should be pretty well recieved.

Lets be honest for a second, a good story is nice but if your innovations and gameplay are fun not many are really going to care about the story and still like the game. Blood was never really meant to tell an epic story IMO, it is an action shooter. It's not Call of the Chultu, or Myst, or something like that.... It's "Run into a room and kill everything and have fun doing it so you can get into the next room and do the same"

Saying all that, I am anxious for anything new on the Blood or Blood 2 front so I say good luck to you and your project :D
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 09:52 pm

@ghost: You're right, that is an age-old question, wasn't thinking when I asked that :P

As for doing a "Transfusion: Source", maybe if B3 turns out to be good, we could look into that. But I'd rather wait until I know for sure that Transfusion is dead. What they've done so far is amazing already, so those are pretty big shoes to fill. (nevermind that trying to further the Blood series involves the filling of gargantuan shoes :lol: )
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:01 pm

I Live...AGAIN wrote:I dont think it's that bad of an idea at all...

But rather than "remove" Blood 2 from the time line, why not just ignore B2's story? What I mean is... there is plenty of time between the story from B1 and B2 and what took place.

If you have some nice innovations planned, and the game will play on xp with a nice port, it should be pretty well recieved.

Lets be honest for a second, a good story is nice but if your innovations and gameplay are fun not many are really going to care about the story and still like the game. Blood was never really meant to tell an epic story IMO, it is an action shooter. It's not Call of the Chultu, or Myst, or something like that.... It's "Run into a room and kill everything and have fun doing it so you can get into the next room and do the same"

Saying all that, I am anxious for anything new on the Blood or Blood 2 front so I say good luck to you and your project :D
That's how we plan on removing it, by purely ignoring it :P

We definitely have some innovations planned, and some new twists on old tricks. (Zombie Head Soccer + Havok... that's all I'm saying :D )

I actually thought the original Blood had a pretty solid backstory. (albeit very cliche).. To tell the truth, one of the main reasons we're spending so much time on the story is to give our cutscene director a chance to spread her creative wings, hehe. But in true Blood fashion, the second each cutscene ends, it'll all be about the shedding of shells.
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Post by kurt » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:07 pm

Shagg E wrote:I definitely can't wait to play your revision of Blood 2, it looks to be what it should have been all along. :D

The reason I want to "amputate" Blood 2 is due to it causing massive restrictions to the storyline. (which will become clear when it's finished)

By the by, I'm not treading on your project by announcing mine in the same place, am I? I hadn't realized that you are also aiming for a similar goal.
I don't have any exclusive rights in this forum, so feel free to say and do as you please.

If you're seriously determined to create such a project on the Source engine, you'll definitely need to consider changing your title first of all. Lawsuits would be sure to follow with the use of "Blood" anywhere in your title.

The storyline that I've planned would actually allow for all sorts of future possibilities though. At best your story might conflict with mine, and at worst it could quite possibly be very similiar to what I have planned.

Transfusion isn't dead though and it could possibly benefit from some added human resources, as could I. But I do wish you all the best with your efforts in achieving whatever your goals may be.
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Post by Shagg E » Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:25 pm

I actually contacted Stephan Weyte (we had planned to pay him to reprise his role as Caleb, but he couldn't legally do it. Surprisingly, he liked the idea, though.), and when he checked with Atari and Monolith about providing voice work, although they told him no, they also said that they had no issues with a fanmade sequel, no matter the title, as long as it's clearly an unofficial, nonprofit game.


Needless to say, my grin was quite wide upon reading that. :P
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Post by RedFanatic » Mon Sep 10, 2007 01:45 am

Ahh the Never ending Slaughter of Blood 3 Topics: They Live :guns: They get Attacked :offtopic: they Stumble :headshot: They Die :rip:

But for as long as this one last’s I still just can’t resist, :D
I think that The RIGHT fans can do an amazing job because they show the proper respect to what came before, Blood 2 although good is the perfect example of too little attention to Fans and the previous History of the Game/Characters Ect.

Also the Steam Engine would be perfect for Blood, having seen Dark Messiah, Sin and even HL2 theres a lot of variance and potential in the engine that could be used to make a superb Blood.

As for what I think it Should/Shouldn’t have:
Only one playable character, Caleb is a massive part of Blood and as cool as some of the other chosen are they ain’t Caleb

AVOID realism: Blood is a very unpleasant and disturbing thing if taken seriously in fact that was one of the larger of Blood 2’s Flaws it was just too serious and frankly unpleasant,
Blood like Duke and SW is a cartoon spoofing and borrowing from films and other things associated with it’s theme, Actions films and Aliens for Duke, The Orient and Manga for SW and Horror for Blood,

This should be born in mind for the game especially for the Dieing acts,
They should be over the top and filmic not like HL2 where as soon as the guy is dead he just falls like a brick, it’s probably more real the HL2 way but I want to see an effect as if he’s a stunt guy being pulled by a wire or the crazy somersaults like out of Fear,
Also rather obviously there should be LOTS of Blood and cool character animes like you shoot a guy with the DB he go’s down then rolls over onto all fours coughing and holding his chest try’s to get up but then suddenly bleeds out and collapse’s ,
And the Burning monk explosion should be done and other variations, it should be very Cartoon-y but still gritty like good old Blood.

As for Cutting out Blood2 I agree but not because of Blood 2 sucking, but because I just don’t think Blood should be futuristic.
The future is always either too Clean or too messy for Blood, if it’s too clean it’s just all wrong for the whole feel of Blood and Too messy (like an post apocalyptic world) leaves nothing for Caleb to destroy.

The best setting I think would be roughly modern day with like the original some weird Frankenstein style technology thrown in (EG the Tesla cannon in the 1920’s)
Also very important is the big enemy should be truly Evil, The Bad killing Bad idea of Blood is also a large draw for me and a big part of the fun.

Weapons:
They should be weird and unusual a lot of time should be spent working out fun versions of the classics like a flame thrower or pistol with plenty of VooDoo and evil magic in there too.
And Lots of hand to hand weapons in fact what would really rock would be the ability to use almost anything as a stabbing or bludgeoning weapon, like scissors or a plank,

But the best thing is that Original Blood is so good the only thing it’s really missing is proper physics so even if you have no creative input at all and just re create Blood on another better engine it would be amazing,
So bottom line is for me just Remake Blood 1 and take nothing away then ANYTHING added will just be gravy.



I'm sure everyone's tired of me going on about this but i did start a sort of Blood3 wish list thing
and here it is
---------->Blood3 Doc<-------------
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Post by ghoste-unlogged » Mon Sep 10, 2007 09:01 pm

@RedFanatic
Cartoon-like Blood is fine. I'd have loved both of them cartoon (1997 classic) and remake (no point to make it cartoonish on modern engine) with visuals equal to Doom3/HL2 at least or better... I cant see why Blood must not be taken seriously apart from driving some people mad by continuously demonstrating violence in explicit manner... Blood2's failure is not originated by "realism", there're lots of other reasons. Yes, fans LOVE the game thats why they cant stand the line with official developers. I dont think its needed to explained why. It just is.
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