Kurt's Plea: split 20091008

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Postby Tyler » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:14 pm

No... Tyler is me Tyler! The Hypertension LUA programmer. :D
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Postby Blood of Nightmares » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:18 pm

Tyler wrote:No... Tyler is me Tyler! The Hypertension LUA programmer. :D


No I can see through the masquerade that your actually Corbin in disguise.
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Postby zZaRDoZz » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:20 pm

Yes but you could be some sort of hallucination bot.

They have those now you know.

Your IP .. :shock:
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Postby Corbin » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:20 pm

Blood of Nightmares wrote:Corbin, your "team" is nothing more than a bunch of schizophrenic hallucinations that doesn't exist, don't try to fool us with your tricks. I betcha all your suppose "team" members that appear in these forums (like "Tyler" and probably "Rebbecca") are all happen to be your alternative user accounts is it not? Pretty much tells me how insane your truly are...

So I'm sure my mapper, Fiend is fake as well? As you can highly tell, not only is he my level designer and co-designer, he was one of the first forum members of Transfusion. He was the one who denounced Kurt's "plagiarism" claim from my previous post that I linked to.

Would you like to see Rebecca's myspace page (just so that's not a random name, her full name was announced in my blog near the start of the project)? She has also asked that if you have a problem verifying her existence, send her a message. Do you really want to play that game? Not only can she verify that
A) She's real,
B) She was my co-designer
C) We used to date around the time the game was created.

There are also tons of pictures of me and her in them.

Starting to question your mental ethics now BON, seriously. I'm starting to wonder if you are insane, kiddo. Go back to watching the X-Files...
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Postby DustyStyx » Sat Oct 10, 2009 05:43 am

We might examine the development of the RE mod a bit later, rigt now it seems a side issue. We are still trying to sort out if Corbin has ripped off B2R or if it's a reasonable conclusion that it's just "inspired." or that they just share elements that are common to Blood and are unavoidably similar.

I have a statement that Kurt had the Cthulhu scientist as far back as February 2009. Looking at the date of that html file, it says it was changed last on June 28, 2009 so we can assume that it is AT LEAST that old. Internet Archives did not have a copy of the page so I can't find definite proof of anything beyond that date.

Corbin has stated that his Dr. West was at least mentioned in the Blood wiki, and this does seem to check out when you dive into the wiki history of December 2008.

Based on the evidence I have been given, I am going to conclude that Corbin did not rip off what Kurt claims to be his idea as far as using a Cthulhu based Re-Animator. You have to get your zombies somehow.

I said I would say something about using public domain materials in new media. There is nothing wrong with this, however if some one uses an element from the public domain in a new work, as I understand it, that new instance of the element does gain a new copyright in so far as it has been portrayed in the new work. For instance, in the game God of War, you are playing in an environment based off Greek mythology. No one is stopping you from doing a separate game based on Greek mythology, but you can't just take the work done in God of War and pick up on the next page and call it your own.

Bon, Clari and Tyler are coming in from different IP addresses. I know it's not impossible to spoof IPs but they are in different states, so I am going to assume that they are different people.
• Tyler 67.171.4#.### Comcast, Washington
• Clari 98.239.8#.### Comcast, California

As I see it is now, both Hypertension and Blood 2 Resurrection still fall firmly in the derivative works of Blood, but not necessarily of each other although they do share what look to be unavoidable similarities.

Kurt, is there anything else you need to add that you feel Corbin is doing to ruin you and B2R development?

So far I have

• Using the work of others in their mod [Done by both parties]
• Corbin talking about the idea of selling his Dreamcast port through Amazon. [retracted by Corbin]
• The complaint about a tip jar. [Negligible]
• Quotes that may or may not be taken out of context. [Negligible]
• A pair of screenshots that emulate Bloods style about as much as they do each other. [Negligible]
• Kurt's claim that Corbin is ripping off his idea of using a Lovecraftian Re-Animator [Disproved]
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Postby kurt » Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:01 am

Dusty, I'm really tired of all of this. I tried to restore a thread that Zardoz derailed, and instead you chose to lock it and then create this one. Now I'm expected to go over all of the same issues that have already been argued countless times. So how am I supposed to answer your question?

I've released over a dozen videos, 2 years worth of screenshots, and spoken about my project in great detail many times. How can I know everything that Clari has taken from all of that when I am not on his team? I may have mentioned my scientist idea at some point in the past 2 years but I honestly can't remember. But I have discussed plot points and characters at various times, and they could all very well turn up in this imitation of his. There are also certain relevant things that I am not willing to discuss here. But his comments that openly admit to copying my work are definitely not negligible though. Sorry, that I have only 1 screenshot to prove that my work has been copied. Should I have to wait for this "inspired" imitation to be completed so that all of the similarities are compared and made apparent to everyone?

Do you want to completely ignore that he suddenly stopped working on his 7 month old Resident Evil thing when he discovered my website? Why would he then suddenly decide to create a Blood mod that evolved to include Blood 2? Two attempts to "re-visualize" the Blood universe being done at the exact same time?! Public admissions of copying? Numerous visits to my website to possibly look for new ideas. A blog that once resembled my own? He even asked once whether he could place his entire blog on my website! Is this all irrelevant information? It follows patterns of his history, but let's ignore all of the evidence of his poor character in the past because you don't feel that matters. All of those conflicts with people, and all of those accusations of theft, lies, and inappropriate behavior, and look where we are today. I'm certainly glad that he has learned something from all of that...

Clari87 wrote:I'm now going to do everything I can to belittle you. I'm going to humilate the f*** out of you. You've given me no choice. And I hope you get sick and throw up, and then choke on your throwup


Then there were all of the attempts to do damage to my work and reputation. This was all done because I was completely honest in my opinions, and talked about what he was doing and what he had done in the past. Arguments such as this one have also done a great deal of damage to my work and reputation as well. I'm not aware of ever having had any real problems with anyone in the past. But now it looks like I'm some kind of crazy asshole for speaking up and trying to defend my hard work and my integrity. The stress and anger of all of this nonsense has caused me to consider whether any of this is even worth it, and I have seriously considered just walking away from it all many times. So this parasitic thief and liar may in fact eventually cause my project to end.

I can no longer talk about this project publicly, or provide any updates at all. So interest in it will most likely eventually fade in time. There will be no new talent offering to help because the project will appear to be stagnant. I will continue to work alone and in the end there will probably be a clone of my efforts released by a parasite with a lengthy apalling history. He may even make some money with his unethical and inappropriate behavior.

So you tell me what incentive do I have to bother continuing with the project that I began long before Clari ever showed up to disrupt people's lives here in the community?

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Postby Corbin » Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:25 am

kurt wrote:Do you want to completely ignore that he suddenly stopped working on his 7 month old Resident Evil thing when he discovered my website?


I knew you would bring this up as your last defense. I'm ready for it, Kurt.

I didn't ignore nor did I stop work on it. Hypertension's codebase started with Fusion's. I co-developed both of them until I found Hypertension to be more fun and fresh. I stopped Fusion after that and then after this got popular, discontinued it. As far as anyone is concerned Fusion was
A) A tech engine test
B) A fanfiction

Sure, it evolved from REU, but it wasn't the same. As a matter of fact, the hellhound code is the only thing from REU that made it into Hypertension.

It became nothing more after that. We never released anything aside from a tech demo showing my skills with my current engine that had nothing to do with Fusion or RE itself.

Also, I was speaking with the Zblood crew long before I spoke to you about it. I was interested in porting it to the EDGE engine, which soon took a further twist. Zblood was what really fueled my efforts, not B2R, although I will admit B2R did help before you got all googly eyed.

kurt wrote: Why would he then suddenly decide to create a Blood mod that evolved to include Blood 2?

It took awhile for Blood 2 material to make it in there. I was a fan of the game when it came out, remember? I liked it just as much as the next fan. I always wanted to do something with it, too. Just like Joe did. Probably like ANYONE who bought the game when it came out and they were sorely disjointed by what they were playing.

kurt wrote:Two attempts to "re-visualize" the Blood universe being done at the exact same time?! Public admissions of copying? Numerous visits to my website to possibly look for new ideas. A blog that once resembled my own? He even asked once whether he could place his entire blog on my website! Is this all irrelevant information? It follows patterns of his history, but let's ignore all of the evidence of his poor character in the past because you don't feel that matters. All of those conflicts with people, and all of those accusations of theft, lies, and inappropriate behavior, and look where we are today. I'm certainly glad that he has learned something from all of that...

I have learned something Kurt. Hypertension is the end result, its enormous public popularity showing some sort of sign. I have admitted this many of times. I have undone what damage I did to my initial community, Doomworld. There might be people who remember, but those people don't care. The Doom world is very different from this one. In Doom's world, many projects are started just like mine. Years and years later, epic greatness spawns from the remnants. This has been proven in Doom's 16+ year history. Postmortem's fallout was mostly due to conflict of design, which you seemed to bring up in a new form of attempted public humiliation. Don't act innocent.

If not Hypertension, then Blood Source. Would that have been "at the same time" too? If I never came around you would've poured your crap all over them like you did with me. What about Zblood? Are you kidding me?

Clari87 wrote:I'm now going to do everything I can to belittle you. I'm going to humilate the f*** out of you. You've given me no choice. And I hope you get sick and throw up, and then choke on your throwup


And then? Want to date that email for me or should I do it? I sent that email to you on August 4th of this year. From then to now, what have I done to actually do that to you? As far as I'm concerned, you did everything in your power to belittle me, humiliate me and my character/gender decisions (numerous times), and then attempted to reverse that upon everyone. Are you aware you've been at this longer than I have? You poked first. Evidence is there too.

As far as I'm concerned, how you are feeling about that is how I felt when you accused my character and made me feel like less of a developer and person because of it. When you brought this up to everyone else, sure I had some problems with it. But I've been way easier on the situation than you have, and I certainly didn't try biting back until your first photoshop.

kurt wrote:Then there were all of the attempts to do damage to my work and reputation. This was all done because I was completely honest in my opinions, and talked about what he was doing and what he had done in the past.

You put forth much, much more effort to halt my project. You mean your photoshop? Or your first criticism of my work, calling it pathetic and misguided? Getting involved in my community and then Doomworld? You had quite a lot of attempts of your own to damage my work and futher damage my own repuation. When previously did I ever do that to you? I didn't. At Dusty's request I am not digging up what is set in stone at Postmortem, but I know that you started that. So we just threw it back at you. Didn't like it, huh? How do you think I felt?

kurt wrote:Arguments such as this one have also done a great deal of damage to my work and reputation as well. I'm not aware of ever having had any real problems with anyone in the past.

Most, if not nearly all, of these arguments stemmed from you complaining about it first. You were the one who created most of these arguments, notice how most of the time I come running after you. I've only showed up here, like Joe said, to set things straight, which Dusty skillfully and professionally did.

kurt wrote:But now it looks like I'm some kind of crazy asshole for speaking up and trying to defend my hard work and my integrity.

You said that. And claiming that I took your idea is called lying, Kurt.

kurt wrote:The stress and anger of all of this nonsense has caused me to consider whether any of this is even worth it, and I have seriously considered just walking away from it all many times. So this parasitic thief and liar may in fact eventually cause my project to end.

You've considered whether you project was "worth it" for some time now, and again I can dig up your posts, your blogs, which you actually said something to this effect, before you could use me as a crutch for your unwillingness to work on your own game. Joe has even stated this, before I did.

kurt wrote:I can no longer talk about this project publicly, or provide any updates at all. So interest in it will most likely eventually fade in time. There will be no new talent offering to help because the project will appear to be stagnant.

Your project has been stagnant for years, Kurt. Going through your blog posts I saw no real interest and no real, serious efforts to help from anyone.

kurt wrote:I will continue to work alone and in the end there will probably be a clone of my efforts released by a parasite with a lengthy apalling history.

Your fault for that one.

kurt wrote:He may even make some money with his unethical and inappropriate behavior.

I certainly could if I could turn your behavior into a comedy show.

kurt wrote:So you tell me what incentive do I have to bother continuing with the project that I began long before Clari ever showed up to disrupt people's lives here in the community?

So far, you're life has been the only one disrupted. Name the others who have been seriously affected by this. Nobody else has. Only after you throw tantrum after tantrum were they forced to look at the evidence.

Now you are showing no real signs or any serious outlook on my copying your project. The evidence was all there and proven, whether negligence, or disproved, like your claim was. This argument wasn't about REU (although it was side thing, not relevant to the ultimate accusation), about my past, or any of that stuff you tried to bring up against me. It was about one thing - Hypertension supposedly copying B2R. It was discredited. You didn't bring up anything new, or anything else you think was seriously wrong without substantial evidence in your following post.

Now it's simply you being bothered by another project that gained support rather quickly. I don't feel that's serious grounds for further trial - it's now personal and a problem only you can be affected by. The rest of the world will keep turning.

(edits: numerous things needed fixing, adding)
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Postby kurt » Sat Oct 10, 2009 12:10 pm

You're seriously deranged Clari, I have to admit it. You constantly have to try to get in the last word and you'll simply spread lies and attempt to cause problems wherever you go. Did Dusty ask for your opinion? No, but I believe he requested me to post, and that is what I did.

I can see that you're so hugely popular that no one wants to post on your forum. You have made many enemies here in the community. You are despised by the entire Postmortem. You were hated by the Doom community as well. Your history is full of people that despise you and think you're a manipulative liar and a clueless idiot.

Yes there was so little interest in my blog Clari, that there were often up to 30 posts for each new update. That's why even now I still receive emails almost daily from people offering me praise and support. My only mistake was in ever posting anything on the internet because it "inspired" such a piece of crap as you to crawl out of the toilet and imitate my work.

Your lies are transparent to anyone with any intelligence Clari. I don't want to argue with you but I'm sure you'll come back.

Dusty, do you see the problems that are caused with your requests for me to post any honest opinions?

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Postby zZaRDoZz » Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:05 pm

EDIT thanks to BON's reminder:

Dusty:
Kurt, is there anything else you need to add that you feel Corbin is doing to ruin you and B2R development?

So far I have

• Using the work of others in their mod [Done by both parties]
• Corbin talking about the idea of selling his Dreamcast port through Amazon. [retracted by Corbin]
• The complaint about a tip jar. [Negligible]
• Quotes that may or may not be taken out of context. [Negligible]
• A pair of screenshots that emulate Bloods style about as much as they do each other. [Negligible]
• Kurt's claim that Corbin is ripping off his idea of using a Lovecraftian Re-Animator [Disproved]


^^Emphasis added by zZaRDoZz.

...zZaRDoZz reflexively held out a hand to shield his eyes from the unfolding disaster. The good airliner KF fought desperately to regain an aerodynamic profile that was impossible this close to the ground. As velocity went well above the spinning aircrafts intended design, shear forces tore at the wings, twisting them free like brittle twigs from a long dead branch. Seconds before impact, the fuselage snapped in two just behind the wings. The high pitched shriek of flaming engines filled the atmosphere, assuredly drowning out the screams of the 100 odd passengers who'd trusted the KF with there very lives. There was a searing white flash followed by a roaring boom a few seconds later. zZaRDoZz lowered his outstretched hand, unshielding the eyes that could never look away. Sooty flames filled the horizon. Bits of twisted aluminum fluttered groundward not far from where zZaRDoZz looked on. The dank smell of burning jet fuel hung heavily in the air. It reminded zZaRDoZz of...

...napalm!?!
Last edited by zZaRDoZz on Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Blood of Nightmares » Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:20 pm

zZaRDoZz wrote: ...zZaRDoZz reflexively held out a hand to shield his eyes from the unfolding disaster. The good airliner KF fought desperately to regain an aerodynamic profile that was impossible this close to the ground. As velocity went well above the spinning aircrafts intended design, shear forces tore at the wings, twisting them free like brittle twigs from a long dead branch. Seconds before impact, the fuselage snapped in two just behind the wings. The high pitched shriek of flaming engines filled the atmosphere, assuredly drowning out the screams of the 100 odd passengers who'd trusted the KF with there very lives. There was a searing white flash followed by a roaring boom a few seconds later. zZaRDoZz lowered his outstretched hand, unshielding the eyes that could never look away. Sooty flames filled the horizon. Bits of twisted aluminum fluttered groundward not far from where zZaRDoZz looked on. The dank smell of burning jet fuel hung heavily in the air. It reminded zZaRDoZz of...

...napalm!?!


The only part you left out in this story that you and Corbin were the ones who shot down KF airliners with Napalm Launchers...

I'm very afraid it's getting very close to the point that "Hypertension" might as well is going to be the final product of B2R thus repeating that history of the development of RE4 being from a standard survival horror game into a generic action game that is released now...(Or maybe if Kurt ever decides to cancel B2R it's very possible that Corbin will too cancel Hypertension because he will have nothing left to steal from and he'll move on to another title that he considers financially successful)...
Last edited by Blood of Nightmares on Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby zZaRDoZz » Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:21 pm

OMG! BON, you're right! I did leave out something!
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Postby Fiend:Kamikaze » Sat Oct 10, 2009 03:29 pm

uuuuuuuuuugh...

I'd like to respond to this, because looking at it is kind of p*** me off.

Corbin, your "team" is nothing more than a bunch of schizophrenic hallucinations that doesn't exist, don't try to fool us with your tricks. I betcha all your suppose "team" members that appear in these forums (like "Tyler" and probably "Rebbecca") are all happen to be your alternative user accounts is it not? Pretty much tells me how insane your truly are...


First of all, I was greatly surprised by Blood of Nightmare's post claiming that I don't exist. I've existed for about 22 years now and if it turned out that I was some figment of Clari's imagination, you'd have to give him credit for being in California and New England at the same time.

Just wanted to clear that up first.

Okay... *sigh*... let's get into this torrent of s***.

I made the level that Kurt has a problem with. His claims that I've stolen from him. On his blog, he posted a quote from Clari87 that said that Clari was going to "try to recreate that shot in Hypertension." I don't know what shot they were talking about, but the one Kurt put up was a picture from my map, which had grass, trees, a walkway, and a stone wall with fence posts on it, next to his map, which had grass, trees, a stone wall, and a cathedral. This is somewhat puzzling, you'd think the big cathedral would be the focus of the screenshot. But the blog claimed that I was "too lazy" to put the Cathedral in.

Kurt, we've never really communicated, and you're already calling me a lazy thief. That's just not polite.

As far as Clari stealing maps, it would be very difficult for him to do since he doesn't contribute any of the maps.

Kurt, I really don't care about your project in even the most superficial way. The only reason I was reminded of it's existence is because Clari linked me to this s***. Years ago, I remember hearing about some Blood 2 overhaul project, which was being done by one guy. I wrote it off as being dead years ago.

I did take up this issue on August 6th on the Hypertension Blog.

"Since I made the map, I feel like I should weigh in on this.

The previous post was a long, drawn out response, but I decided it's easier to just say the following:

The map is... GASP... inspired by the themes of Blood, just as... GASP... Kurt's mod is. When I made that map, the tree model wasn't even finished and didn't have leaves, so it looked so totally different from Kurt's screen (which it still does, for the most part)."


I never got a response from Kurt. I was a little hurt. I thought that maybe he never read what I had to say. *sniff* :cry:

But you insist on being an asshole about this. I don't like people accusing me of stealing. I don't like people trying to derail a project that I'm putting my time into. I'm absolutely sure that there are other reasons you hate Clari87, whatever they may be, but if you want to accuse someone of stealing maps, why don't you talk to me since I'm a level designer?

As far as I can tell, when one thing is disproved, you cook up with another. First, it's "stealing maps," now it's "stealing Herbert West." Next you'll say Clari stole your bike and took your lunch money. I have never, in my life, seen so much p*** and moaning just for the sake of p*** and moaning.
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Postby DustyStyx » Sat Oct 10, 2009 04:57 pm

Dusty, I'm really tired of all of this.
- Same reply as I gave Corbin, if you relinquish the debate, Corbin wins.

I have discussed plot points and characters at various times, and they could all very well turn up in this imitation of his.
- It would be nice to see a clear progression of "I said this, Corbin assimilated that" The Cthulhu scientist example was a valid one, but ultimatly it seems to have been an independently theorized plot point.

"I'm now going to do everything I can to belittle you. I'm going to humilate the f*** out of you.
- That is what I'm trying to determine here Kurt. Can we find proof of this outside of a flamewar. Talk is cheep.

Then there were all of the attempts to do damage to my work and reputation.
- Again, is there proof of this outside of a flamewar?

The stress and anger of all of this nonsense has caused me to consider whether any of this is even worth it, and I have seriously considered just walking away from it all many times.
- Welcome to the life of a Bloodite developer.

I can no longer talk about this project publicly, or provide any updates at all.
- That is fine we only need to go over what has been revealed previously and correlate it with your claims that Corbin is making trouble for you.

So you tell me what incentive do I have to bother continuing with the project that I began long before Clari ever showed up to disrupt people's lives here in the community?
- Your the one that keeps bringing it up. I'm just trying to piece together what you keep going on about.

Do you want to completely ignore that he suddenly stopped working on his 7 month old Resident Evil thing when he discovered my website?... Public admissions of copying?...A blog that once resembled my own?
- Things like this have been know to happen. For example, a kind is happily playing G.I. Joe but one day he goes to his friends birhtday party and all the sudden there's this new Transformers craze goin on. "Holly s*** this is so cool! I want Transformers too!" "No, you can't get an Optimus Prime, I already have it! I even have all his accessories." Kurt, if he didn't care he'd still be ripping off all your stuff, but instead he decided to just get the Decepticons. Just because he still has an Optimus Prime in his collection shouldn't really be a cause of contempt.

It follows patterns of his history, but let's ignore all of the evidence of his poor character in the past because you don't feel that matters. All of those conflicts with people, and all of those accusations of theft, lies, and inappropriate behavior, and look where we are today.
- I'm not going to ignore all of it, but you can't realy expect me to take something he did when he was 14 seriously. Come up with something that's been done after he turned 18 some time in 2006. I'm still looking for specific examples.

I'm certainly glad that he has learned something from all of that...
- I'm inclined to think he has. Again, on the surface they look to be fairly different games. You complained about Caleb in a pettie coat, how different from your version can that get?

Clari87: At Dusty's request I am not digging up what is set in stone at Postmortem
-Oh, you can both dig it up. I just don't what to read through ALL of it. You may copy specific examples into this thread and the other side can respond to identify if it is being taken out of context. If either of you have said something that I have not properly address in this thread please bring it up. There's a lot of text here and I've probably overlooked something.

Dusty, do you see the problems that are caused with your requests for me to post any honest opinions?
-I don't see a problem at all, we are just trying to clear up this whole mess. It's been going on for far to long.

Now, if you will excuse me, I'm going to lock the thread for the rest of the weekend. If some one starts a new thread on this topic I will delete it. I have to prepare the house for a birthday party we are having tomorrow. Please gather your evidence and we'll continue with this on Monday.
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Postby DustyStyx » Sat Oct 10, 2009 07:00 pm

Also, please come up with a finite list of exact charges we can go over. I don't want to read to much into something and have it end up being a red herring.

I'm willing to run everything you can think to present through the wringer, but there needs to be an end to it at some point.
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Postby DustyStyx » Mon Oct 12, 2009 02:26 pm

Okay, the thread is open. Pleas play nice and try not to vent and rant at each other.

Have your charges and the evidence for those charges and the other side can cross examine. If some one else would wish to chime in on something please ask first. Again, if at all possible please used materials that can be dated and verified. A bit of order will help us through this.

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