Blood + Quake = Transfusion also Quake = Half life....

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Necrosis
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Postby Necrosis » Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:34 am

Hate to do a month-bump, but I am not only certain that my Quake music issue is entirely unwarranted (since the song it grabs for me is the same as in this video), but I would like to ask how you turn these on, or if they are always active.
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Postby Caleb_2k » Wed Oct 26, 2005 07:21 am

check the options for "CD Music"
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Postby Caleb_2k » Sat Nov 26, 2005 04:29 pm

i think that is really hard unless you use MSN or some other multi chatt program...

becaue the members of this board is spread worldwide...
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Postby Necrosis » Sat Nov 26, 2005 04:53 pm

I'd go! 8)

That is if my parents would just let me do that kind of thing...
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Postby El Rodeo » Mon Dec 12, 2005 12:08 am

Well I had a Blood, HL2 Mod going for a while, but it was abandoned. Were just gonna do it for HL1.
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Re: Blood + Quake = Transfusion also Quake = Half life....

Postby Mangopork » Fri Feb 17, 2006 02:28 am

Anonymous wrote:Excuse me while I claw out my eyeballs after seeing that post.

HalfLife "Deathmatch Classic" is an abomination.

Source is closed source (meaning we can't improve the engine), and would be requiring every player of Transfusion to purchase HalfLife2 or another Source based game off of Steam (as there is no retail release of HalfLife2 anymore), this would defeat the whole point of using the Quake engine for Transfusion (that of it being a free standalone game using an easily modifiable engine, not a mod for a commercial game), and subject countless thousands to the horror that is Steam. Steam would be alright if it didn't waste cpu time, waste bandwidth, and waste everyones' time.

Additionally Source's lighting model is far less advanced than the Doom3-like lighting supported in DarkPlaces engine (which Transfusion is already using).

It would also be a waste of time to port from one engine to another, this involves rewriting all of the game code, and the project is currently lacking an experienced game code programmer so this new code would be slow in coming.


1] I wouldn't call DMC an "abomination", but I would agree it doesn't match the original.

2] Why would you need to "improve" the source engine? I'm honestly asking. I know it isn't perfect, but its still good tech...

3] Yet source's lighting is still superior to that of Blood... you know, the whole point of this project.

4] Waste of time? As opposed to the time you've spent so well wishing another coder will come to a dying project full of stubborn and (arguably) lazy developers?

5] Welcome to 2006. Steam is not that bad, and nearly every gamer has an excellent machine capable of running any source engine game above 70fps. Steam runs thousands upon thousands of users, and valve happily announces new mods.
How many new players does transfusion have?
Do you even have a stable master server anymore?

Face it. It's time for you guys to get realistic here.

Ask yourself the hard question; DO YOU WANT TRANSFUSION DONE OR NOT?

It's time to stop the frustrated idealism, laziness, and wishful thinking.

At the rate you are going, transfusion will be done in 2015.

If you REALLY wanted this project badly enough you would throw some more elbow grease into the gears and try something new. Obviously, judging by the results currently manifested, what the transfusion team is doing is simply not leading to a finished mod.

If you REALLY wanted it done, you would do WHATEVER IT TAKES TO FINISH.

In the amount of time that has passed since the last transfusion patch you could have finished blood completely twice over with the source engine.

Stubborn developers without a game coder do not finish games. Period.

This project has been going on since before 2002. Make any excuse you want, you've had ample opportunity (and certainly ample time) to finish, but instead you have chosen an engine with near-zero support and even MORE difficulty in terms of development.

With HL2, even if you started from scratch you could get a basic DM mod done over the summer, with a team of 6-10, working 2 hours a day.
This is a modest estimate.

Tried diving into the source sdk? It's actually very impressive, especially from a coding standpoint.


You have two choices here:
1] MAKE AN HONEST DECISION about how badly you want this project done, and then go for it.
2] Go back to sulking in the darkness, wishing for a coder to fall from the sky and work on a dated engine, and accept reassurance and validation for your poor choices from the fanboys on this forum. Really. Go convince yourself that you "did all you could.", then construct an eloquent argument whining about your justifications for lack of progress.

Rationalize, or finish.

Choose.
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Postby Necrosis » Fri Feb 17, 2006 02:55 am

:banghead:

That's all there is to it. :banghead: smileys will express this perfectly for me.
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Postby Mangopork » Fri Feb 17, 2006 03:14 am

El Rodeo wrote:Well I had a Blood, HL2 Mod going for a while, but it was abandoned. Were just gonna do it for HL1.


Link?
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Postby Drakan » Fri Feb 17, 2006 05:01 am

I second Necrosis' statement.

:banghead:
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Postby Kazashi » Fri Feb 17, 2006 05:14 am

Mangopork, long time no see. I'm sorry to say that you've become rather bitter over the years....

I wasn't sure whether to respond to this or not; I can't tell whether it's a troll, or someone just cranky that they don't get to play a game. I imagine the team feels quite insulted about being branded as lazy. I don't know if you remember your college days, but many of the team have real lives. We're not kids any more. Some of us are also disabled; I personally feel quite insulted that you would brand me as being lazy. That is why I feel that this isn't far off being a troll - someone who has stormed (back) in without bothering to check facts or ask questions. All the statements you have made about "not enough time" or "whatever it takes" or "stubborn developers"

Here's one rationale that you seem to have overlooked: open source. You make the claim that the Source engine doesn't need to be open to make the game. How about distribution? How about all the people who don't have HL2, and don't want to buy it just so they can run a single mod?

Here's another one: we never stopped anyone from making a HL/HL2 blood TC (aside from the legal issues such a team would have to be aware of). So, where is it? Where is the team that worked over the summer to complete this Blood DM mod? I seriously doubt that most of the current team would work with Source; I wouldn't. Meaning having to get new developers in - who could've been working on the mod all along.

I'm sorry that the game isn't done. I'm sorry we're not down on our knees proclaiming "my heart isn't in it" and telling you that we really don't want the game done and have merely been sitting around playing cards for years.

Lastly, I don't give in to demands. I'm not going to be frightened into the choices you lay down. Direct your anger elsewhere, maybe at something that isn't just a game.
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Postby Willis » Fri Feb 17, 2006 05:17 am

I'm sorry, Mangopork, but your post is complete and utter crap.

You are missing many realizations that the Transfusion project stands for.

Firstly, we don't want to be depenant on any other game. We highly request people who play it to, frankly, own Blood, but even that is not a requirement. This is the first major strike against the Source engine. Secondly, the Source engine has much higher requirements that the DarkPlaces engine. While we don't intend to support the oldest machines around (in which case you should just be playing the original Blood anyway), we do want as many people to enjoy it as possible. The DarkPlaces engine is not based soley on next-generation specs, it has a very broad legacy support. Further, the DarkPlaces engine is officially supported on many non-Windows platforms, and pseudo-supported on even more.

So aside from dependancy on other games, my second point would be that our current engine is by no means incapable. In respect for what the Transfusion project needs, the DarkPlaces engine is not lacking in any way. In fact, the DarkPlaces engine is one of the most mod-friendly engines around. We were waiting for an option to merge two formats supported by the engine, which was a hold-back for a while, but have since decided to just switch from one to the other and skip the merge, since, I don't think a problem has arisen.

The third point here is that this isn't a game developement company. Everything is done as members find the time. What engine we use is completely irrelivant to this matter. Complaining about the time it takes a volunteer project is just absurd. If our income was dependant on it, it would definatly be another story, but this is our hobby, not our job.

And yet another point is, being volunteer based, time is already an issue, starting over from scratch on something more limited to our wants would be pointless and waste even more time, not to mention we would need to learn new tools and formats just to convert any content over.

So in summary: we're not switching engines. Period. It is not an issue of stubbornness, its an issue of common sense, using what we have & know, and supporting who we feel should be supported in our project, the fans of Blood. Not the fans of Blood who own HalfLife 2.
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Postby Guest » Fri Feb 17, 2006 06:03 am

Yeah...Ummm...And its a good thing Duke Nukem Forever keeps changing engines to try to be top of the line. Wait a minute, it still hasn't been released, has it?

Seriously, get a clue. Switching engines sets any project back significantly. Then there is the fact that the Dark Places engine they are using is actually continually improving and is far from the original Quake engine.

Remember, Half-life 2's "Source" engine is just a glorified version of the engine for Half-life, which was based on Quake's source.
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Postby predator » Fri Feb 17, 2006 08:17 am

I've seen it many times. Every time a new game based on a new engine comes out some fan appears and tells us we must absolutely change our engine and switch to their favorite.
That's the attitude which would make TF be finished by 2015.

And seriously - if you think we have time to work on this project like developers of HL2, or even like all those kids who spend thousands of hours modding for HL2, you are very mistaken. Believe it or not we actually have something called real lives, with lots of things to attend to. We have our families and our work.

Work and other duties come first, hobbies come second.
Maybe sad, but certainly true. At least for us.
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Postby boss429 » Fri Feb 17, 2006 08:04 pm

If you would like to see transfusion finish faster then pitch in and help. Switching to HL2 will not make more developers appear out of thin air and without more developers the project would go the same speed as it did on DarkPlaces (actually even slower since everything would need to be redone). I'm sure you have a skill you could contribute to the Transfusion project. I am learning to skin for Transfusion. I'm sure you could learn how to skin, model, map, or code for Transfusion if you can't already.

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